Alexei Navalny’s meeting with voters from Moscow’s Oktyabrskoye Pole district. Part 2

... nothing original. This is simply done in

all normal cities. There is nothing

impossible here, no need to invent anything. It’s just that

right now, decisions about carrying out

the biggest construction projects are made not

because someone decided that what’s needed is

the North-Western Chord (a major Moscow highway project). No, they came into

an office and said: "Your budget is somehow

too large, 1.6 trillion,

let’s cook up something

for 80 billion." And so they cooked something up. This is not

an exaggeration. Look at what

is happening with the reconstruction of Leninsky

Prospekt.

At first they said: "We’re going to carry out

the reconstruction of Leninsky Prospekt. Anyone

who is against it is an idiot." Now, with the election approaching, residents have

raised hell. Sobyanin came out and

said: "All right, we won’t do

the reconstruction of Leninsky Prospekt."

After the election, our man will say: "Let’s

go ahead and do it after all." Is anyone actually doing any planning? We have

Moskomarkhitektura (the Moscow Architecture Committee), we have

NIPI Genplana (the city planning research institute), we have construction

complexes. Is anyone counting anything at all, or

are we some kind of village with just

chaotic construction? I want to become

the mayor who finally brings

order. A question about migration and

markets.

Well, let’s first assess the migration

situation overall. Do you know that Moscow

ranks first in the world in terms of

the number of illegal migrants? Is that

a normal situation? A proper one?

It’s not a normal situation. Forty percent of all

male Tajiks in the world live in

Russia. In other words, they have practically all moved

here as an entire country. Is that a normal

situation? Right.

I have three clear and sensible

solutions to this problem.

Before I explain them, I first have

a question for those gathered here. Please tell me,

raise your hands if you have been to any

European country. Any one at all.

Okay. And now raise your hand if you

entered that, any

European country without a visa.

How did you get there? You must have had a passport,

probably, he says, of another

citizenship. And which country did you enter

without a visa? Montenegro. Was there Poland?

That doesn’t count.

Montenegro has visa-free entry to

Montenegro. Poland is in the European Union; you need

to get a Schengen visa. So, look,

as far as you and I are concerned,

a visa regime applies. Neither I nor you—we

cannot enter either Germany or

France without a visa. If we go,

for example, to the United States, we will have to give

fingerprints. At the embassy and at the

border, too. And nobody has died from that.

So please explain to me why

any Uzbek or Tajik, even without

an international passport, using only a domestic

passport, can come at any moment

to Moscow. Just buy a ticket and come.

Why are Tajikistan or

Uzbekistan somehow closer to me, closer to us, than France and

Germany? Yes, they are former republics

of the Soviet Union. But we have a visa regime with Georgia (the country),

and with Turkmenistan there is

a visa regime too, right? There is. Nobody died. Everything

is fine, everything works. So what is the difference

for us standing here between Georgia and

Tajikistan, or between Turkmenistan and

Uzbekistan? None. Therefore, the first measure

that needs to be introduced—a normal, not

don’t worry, we have plenty of balloons, we’ll give you

another one. But a normal legal

measure is to introduce a visa regime with

the countries of Central Asia and the South Caucasus. I,

by the way, am the only candidate who

is openly advocating this. All the

others are wavering this way and that.

This is normal. They don’t let me into

Germany without a visa. They don’t let you in either. It is

normal if we do not let in

citizens of other countries. That is how Germans protect

themselves, and that is how we should protect ourselves.

Measure number two is

a measure against those contractors and

companies for whom it is very profitable

to hire illegal workers now. Right now, if you

hire an illegal worker,

the labor is cheap, and if you get caught, it’s

a small fine or a small bribe. I have

drafted a bill stating that

if a company is caught using

the labor of illegal migrants, it

is disqualified. That means it will never again

get access to city

funds. This is a measure that will actually

work.

And measure number three. Within a year, we will

introduce a rule under which any

commercial or state

organizations that use

budget money will not have the right to use that

budget money to hire foreigners.

If it is a fully commercial

enterprise using its own money, that is not

our business. Let them hire whoever they

want. But all these contractor

organizations, these state unitary enterprises, district maintenance offices, and so on,

and so on, that work with our

money, must use our money to

hire Russian citizens, and they have the money

to do that. Or even Muscovites. The money

is there. We hear a lot of tales

and myths about this. You’ve surely heard

this one: "If all the Uzbeks leave

Moscow, we’ll be buried in filth." Have you heard

that?

Yes. They say it all the time. So, if the Tajiks

leave Moscow, there will be no one to clear the snow

cleaning. Heard that?

Well, we do live in Moscow, after all.

We have for a long time. And the truth is that

before 2003 there were no

migrants in Moscow. There weren't any. In most

cities in Russia, there are no migrants.

In Russian cities with populations under

500,000, there are no migrants at all. In

Belarus, there are no migrants at all.

Take the ranking of Russia's most well-maintained

cities. There are no migrants there. By adopting

these three basic

rules, we can seriously limit both

the number of migrants and the number of

crimes associated with these

migrants. We will definitely do this,

because my job as mayor is to work

for Muscovites, not, as I said at the very

beginning, to drag them here because they

kick back to me from their salaries

10,000 rubles every month. Next question.

Yes,

let's keep in mind there are a lot of people, one

person, one question. Pick the main one.

May I?

I'll repeat it for everyone afterward.

A question. The first question is about the financing of

the election campaign. You know that

United Russia is constantly outraged:

"Oh, Navalny's election campaign

is being financed improperly."

Indeed, in terms of the size of our

campaign fund, we are second only to Sobyanin.

Sobyanin has raised, I think, 1 ruble there, and

we have now raised 35 million rubles. What they can't get over

is one simple fact: the sponsors of

our election campaign are

ordinary people. Twenty, or by now around

25,000 people have sent us 100,

200, 500 rubles. That is exactly how

our election

campaign is financed. United Russia simply

cannot calm down. They cannot wrap their heads around the fact

that there are people

who sponsor an election

campaign, that there are people who

send their own 500 rubles for an election. We

compiled statistics on who sends us

money. You know, I myself was simply amazed

by this figure. What do you think? Just

tell me, who is that representative,

the typical representative of the population, in terms of

gender and age, who donates the

largest amount of money on average?

Young people.

Pensioners,

You say young people, pensioners. But for some reason you

are thinking average. The typical

donor for us is a 60-year-old woman.

They still give, that is, these are still

small sums, around 500

rubles, but they donate even more than

young people. I am very proud of this fact,

because our election campaign is

the first election campaign in

Russia to be financed

by actual ordinary people. For me, that means a great

deal, because I

have spent many years

proving to everyone, to you and to myself,

that I can live by the same principles that I

demand from officials. Our Foundation

Against Corruption (ACF) is financed in exactly

the same completely transparent way. You can go in

and see who earns what salary, who

does what, their last name, first name,

patronymic, and what each person's work statistics are.

We have been doing this for many

years. It is hard work, but in

return people donate money to us,

because they are confident that we will use that money

properly, and we

do use it properly. That is exactly

why people continue now

to fund us. That is exactly why

yesterday 35 internet entrepreneurs,

not very big names, not very

wealthy, but nevertheless they quite

openly declared that they support

Navalny and will, among other things,

help finance his election

campaign. Gazprom will not finance

me, and I don't need it.

And all those utility companies,

they finance Sobyanin and everyone else. But

naturally, the people who send me their small amounts of money are a hundred times

dearer and more important to me,

and so are the entrepreneurs who

openly

are not afraid to support me. And the second

question was about my fate.

As I understand it, this is a question about all

these criminal cases and so on. Well, you

know that I have already even been

jailed once, right? And yet here I

am, standing before you speaking. And at

every meeting where I am asked

about this, every time I tell

residents: thank you very much, because

it was thanks to you that I was released. Precisely

thanks to you, thanks to those who came out

into the streets, thanks to those who were outraged.

And for the first time in the history of this government, we showed

that we do not believe it has the right

to imprison anyone without proper trial or investigation,

on the basis of any fabricated

charge. And we do not want things to

be that way. And something happened that I myself

did not believe in when they led me to the cell.

Of course, I understood that I was not going to spend five years

in prison, but if someone had told me

that people would take to the streets and that the

next day I would be released, I would never

have believed it. So my

fate, grand as that may sound,

is entirely in your

hands. As long as I have the support of

the public, they cannot do anything to me

No. No one is going to jail me, and we ourselves

will put everyone else in jail with you.

Alexei, may I ask you a question?

Yes, of course. Go ahead, ask your question.

Well, I want the microphone passed in turn. Don't

hide it. So, many residents among us

and Muscovites in general are interested in this:

why does Sobyanin publish decrees

that don't work? I would like

this question to reach Sobyanin

personally. Please, if possible, pass it on to him.

If he issues such decrees and they do not

work, why are they published in the press?

Specifically, this affected everyone with water meters.

Specifically, it was published in all

the newspapers that water meters

did not need to be inspected. It was. Let Sobyanin

answer us in the press or on television

why his decrees do not work. Otherwise our

district will not go to the elections. Many

Muscovites and local residents will agree with me.

We simply will not go to vote at all.

All right, wait. I liked everything you said

except for the last conclusion. It's just that if

you want to get something across to Sobyanin,

you should know that Sobyanin is waiting for you not

to go to the polls. Sobyanin understands that

he can win only with low

turnout. If the entire protest

electorate says, "Our protest

consists of staying

home," Sobyanin says, "Excellent,

thank you very much." What is your name?

My name is Lidia Petro... On Putin's elections

our district was among the best

it was noted. Look, in our

district things have become better, if our people and we

think it over for these elections too.

Lidia Petrovna, you demanded the microphone so decisively

from me that I

expected some kind of unpleasant

question for me. But as you can see, you are asking

a question for Sobyanin and asking me

to pass it on to Sobyanin. And why do you think,

Lidia Petrovna, and everyone gathered here,

why Sobyanin refused to go to

a debate with me?

He's afraid.

Exactly. Precisely because he

is afraid that I will pass on a question from

Lidia Petrovna.

That's all. Because his people are here

and he

his people are here, of course his

people are here. Representatives of the district administration are probably standing here

writing everything down,

filming everything, and so on. But, Lidia

Petrovna, here's the conclusion. Everything you said is right. I came here

precisely because all these laws and

all this outrage—I share it with you

too.

The very same laws that do not work

for you also do not work for

me. But if our conclusion is that we

simply won't go to the polls as a sign

of protest against Sobyanin, that's like the story

of the rabbit: "Don't throw me into the briar

patch." Sobyanin is just waiting for you, as a

sign of protest, not to go vote.

Then he'll bus in his Kyrgyz voters

on three buses, and they will vote at

every polling station, and he will say, "You know,

I won with 85 percent.

Muscovites have trusted me again. Muscovites

have placed their trust in United Russia. Many thanks

to the people of Moscow."

Are we really going to let ourselves be deceived like that?

That's all. Therefore, Lidia Petrovna, I share your

outrage, but the tactic of struggle

is wrong. Please, the right

question. Well, I don't know. Go ahead. All right,

good. Thank you. I wanted to ask a question,

well, it probably connects somehow with

what has just been said.

Naturally, you are a practical person,

a realist. You understand that all these

people at the trough

are not simply going to hand everything over to you. What

they have, so to speak, acquired through "backbreaking labor,"

right? You understand? And yet the position

of mayor is, after all, a position of

an administrator. How are you going to

combine administrative work and

politics? They will put spokes

in your wheels. What then? Won't it turn out that

all this obstruction

will produce, so to speak, poor

performance, and then they will say to you, "Well,

there you are, you became mayor, but you still can't

deliver, can you?" Thank you very much.

Excellent question. Indeed, could it not

turn out like this: you elect me mayor,

and then they take everything away from Moscow,

all the money, take it all away, and it turns out

that bang—tomorrow there's no hot water

anymore. That won't happen, because

Moscow is very rich and very large. And

the specifics of the budget process and

the tax code are such that

it is impossible to take this money away from Moscow, from Muscovites, from the mayor

of Moscow. And in Moscow we

can pursue a completely independent

policy. You are right to say that

there are many administrative functions, of course. But

we should remember that, broadly speaking, the job

of the mayor of Moscow—and 90 percent of the mayor's time—

goes to what? He travels around, cuts

red ribbons, and hands out

certificates of honor. The main task

the mayor of Moscow must solve is

to establish proper principles for

building a team, so that all the people

working in the top positions

at city hall know that stealing is hard,

stealing is difficult, stealing is dangerous. And if

you steal, you will be fired, and if

you are caught doing it, you will go to jail.

This is not some abstract thing that

I’ll explain it with a simple example that

I also bring up at every rally.

Please remind me, what is the biggest

corruption case in

Russia right now,

other than Kirovles.

Serdyukov. Right, Serdyukov. Please remind me,

is Serdyukov in prison?

No.

Has Serdyukov even been charged?

No.

Serdyukov is still driving around in a

Mercedes

provided by the Defense Ministry, and he still has

an official flashing beacon assigned to him. And Vasilyeva, his

accomplice, where is she now?

In a thirteen-room apartment.

That’s right, as you say, under house

arrest she is allowed three hours a day

for walks. And during those walks she gets

photographed in jewelry stores

buying jewelry with honestly earned money,

apparently. Yes. What’s more, let me tell you,

my friends, since not all of us here are

lawyers, probably,

and in Vasilyeva’s case,

house arrest is formally

classified as restriction of liberty, which

will later be counted toward her sentence at two days for every one.

If Vasilyeva is ultimately sentenced, say,

to two years in prison, then she will be

released immediately,

because she will have effectively already served it

under her very strict house

arrest. What I’ve just told you is not news

to you.

Everyone knows this. These are the openly declared

principles for shaping

the bureaucracy in Russia: steal, grab,

skim. Nothing will happen to you if you

observe the main conditions: political

loyalty, the right portraits on the wall, and

kickbacks to those above you. And then you’ll be

just fine. I want to become the mayor who

will, with the support of Muscovites, carry out

a normal personnel policy. There are

examples of this. In Singapore, when

Lee Kuan Yew took charge, the city, populated by

Chinese people, was also full of folks

inclined toward corruption. He said,

that in order to defeat corruption,

I jailed half of my friends. But now

there is practically no corruption left

in the city. And there won’t be any in Moscow either, because I

want to be the kind of mayor whose

officials all follow their

instructions. And if you do not follow

instructions, you get fired. People are

adaptable. In Moscow City Hall, the city is

run by tens of thousands of people. And if those

tens of thousands of people see

that the leadership lives by the right

principles and really does fire everyone

and jail people for corruption and for failing to follow

instructions, they will all fall into line and everything will

start working here the way it works all over

the world. Your question.

Alexei, could you please explain how you

view

the part of Moscow’s budget financing

that involves attracting

investment, and our

business community—

TNK, Rosneft, Gazprom, Norilsk

Nickel, MTS, Beeline, and so on?

How do I view the business community

that finances the Moscow budget—

Rosneft, TNK, Norilsk Nickel?

Some of those you mentioned have already

re-registered elsewhere. In fact, a mayor

should not have any special attitude toward them. Right now, I

as a shareholder view these

companies negatively, because I know that

they are robbing me as a shareholder and you as

the owners of the country’s natural resources. But

as mayor I want only one thing: for these

companies to pay taxes into my budget. And

I have no good or bad

attitude toward them. All that needs

to be done is to act according to the law.

No preferences, no special advantages,

no special arrangements. Pay your taxes

and that’s it. That is exactly the job

of any mayor. Yes. Next question.

A question. I have this question for you,

Alexei—could I have the microphone too, please?

Yes, please. Alexei, our

only hope really is

a change of mayor in Moscow, because even this

small park where we are all standing

is now supposed to have a road run through it via Strogino.

That means it will no longer be here;

instead there will be a six-lane highway here.

Alexei, we, the residents of this district—you

can hear this roar right now, and we hear it

at 5:00 in the morning and at 2:00 at night. We are

asking you very strongly to stop this

construction of highways through residential neighborhoods,

because the Fourth Ring Road

would have cost many times less than these

highways running along streets all across Moscow.

They are planning to remove the Mnyovniki floodplain

from protected natural area status solely so that this

expressway can pass through it. I understand that we

have already discussed the expressway, but I want

to say that it will be

impossible to live here. We really will have to,

as Sobyanin advised us, leave

this city. But I do not want to leave

this place. I was born here. My ancestors lived here

back in the days of the tsars (the Russian emperors). And

so for me this is, this is my

home place. So, Alexei,

please do everything you can to make sure that

highways do not run through residential neighborhoods.

They promised a crossing on Vershinina Street,

underground, above ground, whatever kind.

There will be no such crossing. There will be a crossing near

in Oktyabrskoye Pole, and here on

Berzarina Street. This entire square, all the way to the

railway tracks, will be destroyed.

So, residents, I’m asking you very strongly, don’t

stay asleep. Please write letters to the

mayor’s office. We have one month left while they’re still willing to listen to us.

After that, they’ll only

spit on us. Thank you very much for

Thank you very much. You seemed to begin by saying

that, uh, you’re practically certain that I

am winning this election, and ended by saying

that, as you put it, in a month they’ll

spit on us. If we win the election,

no one will be spitting on us. Our last

hope is ourselves, my friends. We

ourselves. If we believe that we are the ones who create power,

then everything will change.