"Ricochet" from February 21, 2019. FBK investigation into clans, corruption, and violence in the North Caucasus

In Moscow, it is 18:34. This is Alexander Plushev. The program is "Ricochet." Today, another investigation by the Anti-Corruption Foundation was released: "Bentleys, palaces, murders. How is the North Caucasus organized?" You can view it on the website navalny.com. But let me warn you right away: it takes quite a lot of time to watch and read. I personally managed to get through it only on the second try. Nevertheless, it is really interesting, as our guest on "Special Opinion," Grigory Yudin, said. He said that if you overlay the family tree diagram onto the diagram of governing the Republic, they will coincide. We have Alexei Navalny, head of the ACF, on the phone line with us. Alexei, good evening!

Good evening!

Were you surprised by this: by what came to light as a result of this investigation with such a curious trigger? Had you not suspected this before?

I was surprised, to be honest. That is not to say there were some super-revelations. We understood perfectly well, and I think everyone in Russia understands, that the North Caucasus is run by clans. But the fact that they run it so completely, actually one hundred percent merged with the governing structure... After all, these people are officials. There are practically no businessmen there. Officials who are at the same time multimillionaires, and at the same time murderers. That is, when we say "officials are bandits," that is often a rhetorical device. But there, in reality, one of the clans is run by a man who killed seven people, burned their bodies, hid them in a mine, and served less than 10 years for it, which honestly is fantastic even by Russian standards.

Yes. Well, today we were recalling with colleagues from the news service that story about the shooting while visiting guests. And it was a very high-profile story. And, of course, it is very surprising that people are still in prison for it. I want to ask our radio listeners a question traditional for this program. And it will be a vote. The thing is that we (myself included) still perceive news from the Caucasus as coming from some special part of Russia, perhaps even from somewhere that is not really Russia. And I want to ask our listeners: for you, is the North Caucasus something separate, or is it still an ordinary part of Russia? Well, rather something separate, or rather an ordinary part of Russia. If you perceive the North Caucasus as something separate, then call 101 20 11. If as an ordinary part of Russia, then 101 20 22. And I have the following question for Alexei. Why should this be interesting to us at all—to Muscovites, Petersburgers, people from Voronezh, I don't know? After all, this is somewhere out in Karachay-Cherkessia.

Because the people of Moscow, the Moscow Region, St. Petersburg, and so on pay for all this luxurious life of the sultans of Karachay-Cherkessia and the Caucasus in general—that is firstly. And secondly, in any case, this is part of the Russian Federation. And if you watch our short film, you can see how perfectly integrated these people are with the Moscow elite. For example, we mention one of the family members there who headed the Interior Ministry of the Republic. He now works in the Moscow Government, by the way. They all sail yachts there together with the Rotenbergs. That is, these are not, you know, some wild mountaineers who somewhere out in their village are cutting each other up and keeping money in chests. Not at all. This is part of the Russian and Moscow elite, which spends much more time in Moscow and abroad than in its own republic.

In general, is this an exception? Because, again, Grigory Yudin from Shaninka and I were discussing this, and he says that, by and large, probably all of Russia is organized this way; it is just at the republican level, perhaps multiplied by the specifics of the North Caucasus, but in principle, yes, several dozen families control Russian business. Isn't that so?

I would say even more. For example, Krasnodar Krai, a perfectly Russian region (it is close to the Caucasus, but still). It has the same level of banditry and constant murders—well, it is enough to recall the Tsapoks and all those prosecutors—quite comparable to Karachay-Cherkessia (and in places even worse). And all this there is done by people whose passports absolutely say that they are Russian.

As for the investigation, as for the facts collected. You found out that some people there have Bentleys, some people there have a mansion with suspended ceilings, some have something else. But in the end, one way or another, they are engaged in business. A peculiar kind of business. I mean business affiliated with the state, yes. But after all, they do not live on a state salary. Where is the discrepancy?

Let's not quibble over details, but look at the president of the Republic—Mr. Temrezov, whom we mention not even very much. We simply took and calculated the cost of his wristwatches. And we see that there is not just a discrepancy, but a discrepancy of fantastic proportions. His official income, which he shows in his declaration, is 74 thousand rubles a month. The president of Karachay-Cherkessia. He has watches worth tens and hundreds of millions of rubles. Just wristwatches. We will not even count all these Bentleys and everything else. At the beginning of the program I already said that you need to set aside time to see all this. Indeed, our video turned out quite long—25 minutes. But we simply stopped there. We had enough information for a dozen such videos, because wherever you go there from one official to another, you see that it is all one and the same family. And these are people who do not even try to hide their fantastic wealth. After all, trips on private jets are not even business-class tickets. This means that a person possesses millions of dollars at a minimum.

And in general, what can be done with all this in the current system of governance?

Well, we ask ourselves this question as if it were some completely unsolvable problem. But the question is not what to do with it, but why the murderer of seven people was released from prison after serving less than 10 years? Why does the president of the Republic, whose income obviously does not match his expenses, remain at the head of it while being connected to this murderer? Therefore, all that needs to be done in the North Caucasus is simply to apply the most elementary measures provided for by the Criminal Code. That's all. Nothing extraordinary is needed. If legality operated there even at the level of the Moscow Region or Moscow, where there is little legality, things would already be much better.

Let me remind you, we have a vote going on. It will continue for a couple more minutes. How do you perceive the North Caucasus (in terms of news)? Is news from there something separate for you, or an ordinary part of Russia? If something separate—101 20 11. If an ordinary part of Russia—101 20 22. We have Alexei Navalny on the phone. And I want to ask you, Alexei. Naturally, voices immediately began to be heard... And our connection with Alexei Navalny was interrupted precisely at my most awkward question. What can I do? First, I can call for our connection with Alexei Navalny to be restored. Second, I can recommend that you watch this investigation, which is on navalny.com; draw your own conclusions from this investigation, how convincing it is to you, whether it seems plausible or not. And I can also sum up the results of our vote. We asked how you perceive the North Caucasus—is it something separate or an ordinary part of Russia. And here is how the votes were distributed: 87% said that it is something special, separate, an unusual part of Russia, and only 13% of those who took part in the vote consider it an ordinary part of Russia. Alexei, are you back on the line?

Yes.

Sorry, please. The connection was interrupted. Final question. We literally have a minute. As soon as you start talking about the North Caucasus, people immediately recall "stop feeding the Caucasus," "Alexei has again lapsed into nationalism," or something else in that spirit. Answer in half a minute what you think about this.

Today I posted this video in the main community on VKontakte where all the natives of the Republic are gathered (it is the main community of the Republic). There everyone is thanking me and thanking our entire group that conducted the investigation. This is the highest praise for us. And, in general, we believe that we achieved our main goal—people are writing that this is exactly how it is, and thank you for shedding light on this situation.

So, do people in the Caucasus themselves perceive this normally? This is not an anti-Caucasus statement from their point of view?

It is absolutely a pro-Caucasus statement. We are speaking out against these sultans; against the fact that they keep entire peoples in poverty and subjugation. Therefore, of course, this is a pro-Caucasus video. And that is exactly how people perceived it.

Thank you very much! Alexei Navalny, politician. And once again, watch his investigation on the website navalny.com about Bentleys, palaces, murders, and how the North Caucasus is organized.